The Sober Butterfly Podcast
The Sober Butterfly – A fun, unfiltered podcast for sober & sober-curious women! 🦋✨
Hosted by Nadine Mulvina, NYC-based content creator and sober travel expert, this podcast explores sober dating, alcohol-free living, harm reduction, addiction recovery, and mental health—with humor and honesty.
Expect real talk on:
✔️ Navigating sober dating & relationships
✔️ Thriving socially without alcohol
✔️ Sober travel & alcohol-free experiences
✔️ Harm reduction & recovery stories
✔️ Non-alcoholic drinks & sober events
Whether you're sober, sober-curious, or rethinking alcohol, The Sober Butterfly is here to inspire you. Subscribe now and join the sober revolution!
The Sober Butterfly Podcast
The Alcohol Free Alchemist: Kristen’s Sober Story From Mommy Wine Culture to Queen City Sober
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
In this powerful episode of the Sober Butterfly Podcast, host Nadine Mulvina sits down with Kristen, creator of The Alcohol Free Alchemist and founder of Queen City Sober, to share her deeply relatable sobriety journey.
Kristen opens up about how her drinking evolved from social partying to daily coping — influenced by anxiety, grief, motherhood, and the normalization of “mommy wine culture.” After experiencing profound life stressors, including the sudden loss of her grandmother and her husband’s lymphoma diagnosis, alcohol became her way to numb and manage overwhelm.
But her sobriety didn’t begin with a dramatic rock bottom. It started with an awakening — a Father’s Day morning realization that changed everything.
Now nearly 600 days alcohol-free, Kristen shares how sobriety transformed her relationship with herself, her marriage, her children, and her identity. She also discusses navigating social situations without alcohol, sober intimacy, non-alcoholic alternatives, and building real-life sober community through Queen City Sober in Buffalo, New York.
If you’re sober curious, questioning your relationship with alcohol, navigating motherhood, or looking for inspiration to start again, this conversation will resonate deeply.
You don’t need to hit rock bottom to choose something better.
🎧 In This Episode We Discuss
- Mommy wine culture and the normalization of daily drinking
- Using alcohol to cope with anxiety, grief, and stress
- The “awakening” moment that led to sobriety
- Early sobriety exhaustion and emotional healing
- Marriage and intimacy without alcohol
- Socializing sober and building confidence
- Non-alcoholic drinks and alternatives
- Sober parenting and being more present with kids
- Creating sober community through Queen City Sober
- Kristen’s platform: The Alcohol Free Alchemist
Sponsors
📚 Audible – Get lost in a new book (or re-listen to your fave self-improvement reads). Try Audible FREE for 30 days and get a free audiobook with your trial.
https://www.audibletrial.com/tsb26
🌟 ClassPass – Try ClassPass for FREE & get 20 bonus credits! Sign up here https://classpass.com/refer/KU6D7B8B28
👩🔬 Connect with Kristen
Follow Kristen and her work:
The Alcohol Free Alchemist (Instagram) https://www.instagram.com/thealcoholfreealchemist/
Queen City Sober Community — Buffalo & Niagara Falls, NY (Instagram) https://www.instagram.com/queencitysober/
🦋 Connect with The Sober Butterfly
https://www.instagram.com/the.soberbutterfly/?hl=en
Follow Nadine for sober lifestyle, travel, and wellness inspiration:
Podcast Instagram: @soberbutterflypodcast
💬 If This Episode Helped You
Please share it with a friend — especially another mom or woman who might need to hear this message.
Sobriety doesn’t start with perfection.
It starts with awareness.
Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services refereed to in this episode.
Hello. Hello butterflies and welcome back to the Sober Butterfly Podcast, the show where we explore sobriety, healing, and building a life that actually feels good without alcohol. I'm your host, Nadine, and as always, I'm so grateful you are here. Before we dive in, I wanna say a quick thank you for your patience with this episode. There was a little bit of a delay because I was traveling to Dubai, which if you follow me on Instagram, you probably saw, but we are officially back and I'm so excited to share this conversation with you because it is such an important one. Today's episode is about something so many women experience, but don't always talk about openly the intersection of motherhood, anxiety, grief, stress, and what we often call mommy wine culture. Because for a lot of us, drinking doesn't start as a crisis. It starts socially, casually, acceptably. Until one day it isn't. I'm so excited to introduce today's guest, Kristen, whose sobriety date is June 24th, and who is now nearly 600 days alcohol free. We actually met at my Hot Girl Sober Summer event. Yes, the Booty Band workout in the Extreme Heat, and I knew immediately she had a story that needed to be shared kristen opens up about starting to drink as a teenager, using alcohol to help her cope with anxiety and stress, and then how her drinking escalated after profound life events, losing her grandmother shortly after becoming a new mother and later navigating her husband's lymphoma Diagnosis. What makes our story so powerful is that there wasn't some dramatic rock bottom. There was an awakening, a Father's Day morning moment that changed everything. In this episode, we talk about mommy wine culture and the normalization of daily drinking, using alcohol to cope with grief, stress and anxiety, early sobriety, exhaustion and emotional healing, marriage and intimacy with out alcohol, socializing, sober non-alcoholic drinks and alternatives. Building confidence without alcohol and creating a sober community, including Kristen's platform, queen City, sober. If you're a mom sober, curious, questioning your relationship with alcohol or just wondering what life might look like without the constant. This episode is for you. Let's get.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Hello, Kristen. Welcome to the Sober Butterfly Podcast. I'm so excited to have you and like we actually got to connect in real life this summer when you pulled up to Hot Girl sober summer.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356by saying that five times fast.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356So excited. I actually won tickets to that. So I'm in like the Buffalo area, but I'm originally from Brooklyn. So my, my best friend, she lives in Staten Island, so I won those tickets and I happened to be off from work, so I was like, let's go, let's do it. So yeah, it was like a little road trip and then I brought her with me to the, the event. It was a lot of fun. Very hot though.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356lot of fun. It, I was gonna say it was sweltering. This
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356early July, I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356I was like carrying all of the supplies for the party and I was literally dripping of sweat by the time we even started to set
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Oh yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356then there was a workout for people who are unaware of this event. There was like also a booty band workout led by cat from Sober fit and kudos to you and the girls. 'cause I, I did not do that. I did not do that workout. was in the back, taking photos and filming content, but I was like, I cannot work out right now. This is just insane. It was like 101 degrees.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356I went a little too hard on that day working out. I, I, I, yeah, I kind of got a little ill at the end of it. I was trying to give it my, I was trying to give it my all. I was too excited about it, and I saw that people were recording, so I was like, I gotta look good.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah, the pressure's
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356in my
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah. And then as soon, well, it's okay, but as soon as the camera stopped rolling it, you know.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356If we ever do anything like that again, it cannot be outside in, in summer
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Just, no,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah. I mean, I got my workout in, I'll say that. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356spot was real for all of us, whether you participated or not.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Well, Kristen, I'm so glad to see you again and, I am so honored to have you on today so we can learn a little bit more about your sober story I believe I saw your sobriety date was June 24.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356So, yep.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356I would love to learn more about like how like seed was planted for you. And if you could just describe for us a little bit about your life before
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356dark ages is how
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah. Yeah. So like I said, I, I'm, I'm from New York City, so I grew up in Brooklyn. So, I mean, it was very easy to just like, get whatever you wanted. So I started drinking as a teenager and just kind of getting into, you know, the wrong crowds. I mean, I did great in school and everything like that, but I, you know, worked hard and. Played hard. So I used it even as a teenager a lot to just like kind of relax and, you know, I feel like that got me into a lot of different, bed situations. But,, I went off to pharmacy school afterwards and, my drinking kind of transformed, I feel like throughout my life of drinking. So, it started as kind of fun, social, and, you know, especially in college, it was a good time. And then it started to just kind of turn to more like self-medication, just as things, you know, happened in my life. I have two children. A 7-year-old and a 4-year-old. When my first son was born about a month in my grandmother passed away very tragically. And she was like a mother to me. Like I grew up in like a house with her. She was on vacation. In Iceland and then like slipped on a black sand beach and yeah, so she died on vacation, so it was completely out of the blue. And I had like a one month old at home and it was just like, you know, I had all this, these dreams of like breastfeeding and doing all this, and I was like, Nope, I need alcohol right now in order to even comprehend this loss. I feel like that's when the. Things took a dark turn is when I started using it just to kind of, you know, cope. And then, there's a lot out there with mommy wine culture and just saying, oh, it's totally fine to need a glass of wine, or, you know, relax with that in, in that sort of way with alcohol. So I kind of didn't see anything wrong with it. Time went on. I had a second kid and then after my second kid was born, my husband was unfortunately diagnosed with lymphoma. We were very much spinning our wheels of what was going to happen. And once again, I turned to alcohol kind of as my coping mechanism. And then as time progressed it just kind of became a daily thing. I was just daily drinking and, I kind of just saw no way out of that.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356I remember, it was interesting, I read a Buzzfeed article and it was like about people who like, oh, maybe do you drink too much? And it was just like a lot of different situations. And I was like, oh, I kind of like, a lot of these things might apply to me. Like, yeah, I am passing out on the couch, like I am forgetting things. I'm watching like, hmm, like maybe I should think about this. And then my husband started saying to me like, oh, Maybe you're drinking too much. And of course I was very defensive about it and I, you know, didn't wanna agree with that, but I was like, Hmm, maybe he's right. Probably my phone was listening to me and it started leading me to sober Instagram. Then I started seeing some accounts and I actually found my sober coach Lindsay Henneke. And I connected with her and I was like, wow, there are other people out here like me. I even spoke with my therapist about it, and she's like, oh, well, would you wanna go to aa? And I'm like, I, I don't think I could do that. I, I don't know, I don't think I'd be comfortable. And then I started realizing there was a lot more. Options out there. So, like I said, I connected with my sober coach and, I did about six months of group therapy with them and connected with so many other people and. I realized like sobriety was a, was an option for me and life was a lot better without alcohol for sure. So yeah, then I decided about like five months in that I was going to start my sober Instagram account. 'cause I figured, you know, if I could help one person or, connect with one human being in some way it would be worth it to me. So I just put it all out there.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356That's
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah. Thank you for sharing.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356that with us.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356I first, and for foremost, want to say I'm really sorry about the passing of your grandmother.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356thank you.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356imagine how. Traumatic. That must have been for you, especially it being so unexpected.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356I can somewhat relate in the sense that I lost my father unexpectedly. Grief is one thing, but like when you have no preparation whatsoever, like for that and it just comes out left filled, like it, it can be very jar obviously more than jarring. It
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356can knock you off your axis.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356And then I, I feel like I'm not a mom, but I can only imagine. On top of that, like you are responsible now for this human being.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356and so like you have no choice. You have to keep going if not for yourself, for your offspring, your
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356And that pressure may also feel very mounting and overwhelming. And then I'm just wondering from you, like, did like postpartum a role in any of
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Oh yes.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356postpartum,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356With, with both of my, oh yeah, for sure. With both of my kids, you know. I definitely experienced those types of feelings and then, you know, compounded with actual other things going on. It was definitely like a perfect storm. And, you know, I thought alcohol was helping all of this,, I needed it to, to help with my anxiety and my stress. Yeah, come to find out.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356be my question. What was alcohol doing? And I'm air quoing this, like doing or giving you or that false sense of like giving you in that time in your
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356I just always had so much going on and, you know, it was just like such an a way to turn off my brain. Because like I could sit down and I'm still like, oh my God, what have I gotta do? I'm like making lists here and there. So it was just the way to really just shut off my brain. And I mean, it kind of is exactly that, you know?
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356So I mean, it just did the trick of just like, okay, well, you know, literally, like I said, you know, I, I had this tragic news happen and I'm like, I can't handle it. I've gotta. Turn it off somehow, and it was just the best way I knew how to do it.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah, you mentioned your husband. Kind of like, I don't wanna use confronted. That sounds extreme, but mentioned to you like, Hey, I think you may be drinking too
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356I think oftentimes we shut down and we're like defensive immediately.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah. Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356But like, I genuinely believe sometimes that there are like signs or whispers or like other things that come into play, like beyond someone saying directly to you, like, is everything okay? Are you drinking too much? But like, even just seeing that, that like. Article and
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356unassuming. You're like, Hmm, let me just follow along clickbait. But then you start, it starts to like make you question
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356aware in that moment or not or ready to accept help in that moment or not.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356all of these things that come into play and I genuinely believe like these are signs directing you to a bigger purpose and I love that you found connection. Through like non-traditional means. Because I do think also sometimes hearing aa it's like, wait, what are you saying? Like your therapist mentioned
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356same thing what my therapist did, I was like, pump the brakes.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356we're not there yet.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_2_02-08-2026_153356Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_2_02-08-2026_153356don't know what you're talking about. And like that can keep us stuck too for so long. So I love that you found like your own non-traditional way to finding that support in that community and then ultimately deciding for yourself that you were done.
Nadine MulvinaHave you ever wished you could dive into a great story while on the go? Maybe that's during your daily commute or even while working out. Well, now you can, thanks to Audible. Audible is the leading provider of spoken word entertainment in audiobooks, and with Audible, you can turn any moment into a storytime adventure. Imagine having access to an unmatched selection of audiobooks, right now. Audible is not just a library. It's a whole Experience with a vast collection of genres from mystery to romance to self help and business Audible has something for everyone and here's the best part Your first month is on me check the show notes below and visit audible. com slash tsb24 to start your free trial today. Whether you're a seasoned book lover or just getting started, Audible is the perfect companion for your reading journey. So why wait? Head over to audible. com slash tsb24. Audible. Because the best stories are meant to be heard.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Let me back up a little bit. Because you also mentioned there's a lot going on here, right?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733You're a new mom, your grandmother who was like a mother to you has passed on, and then on top of that, your husband was diagnosed with cancer. So how did that impact you emotionally and just like all of the things going on as well, did that. Anything in terms of your dynamic with alcohol and your relationship with your husband at the same time?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah. This obviously didn't happen overnight. This happened over the course of like several years. All of this was going on. But you know. Once again, when it came down to when my husband was diagnosed, there was a lot of pressure on me to just kind of, hold the family together in a sense of you know, he still obviously did a lot, but he was pretty sick for a while. So, you know, there was just a lot of pressure to just remember everything. So, once again, using alcohol to turn my brain off and, this is now when I can relax, like, okay, I'm so worried about everything and now I can turn it off for a, moment and, you know, that's what I thought at least, that it was. Stop stopping my stress in that regard. But it really wasn't, it was just prolonging it.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734But yeah, that's what I pretty much used it for, was just a way to kind of relax and husband, he was in a lot of pain, so he also was like, like using alcohol for pain as well. Like I know like he was trying to obviously use pain medications, but sometimes he would have a drink to kind of take the edge off. So, it felt like a way we could connect in a way as well. So that was a bit of a challenge. But like I said, I always took it a little bit too far.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Right, right. And In the early days of you questioning your relationship with alcohol and then finding a sober coach and going through that process, some people like there's a rock bottom. I don't know if, like everyone believes in rock bottoms. I know that my bottom could have dropped a lot further, so, I genuinely just. Felt like there was one moment where I woke up though, and was just like, I'm just tired. Like I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733how much more I can sustain this, whatever this is. I couldn't quite put my finger on it, but I just knew that I was just so sick of it. I was so sick of it. So I'm curious, did you reach that place? What happened? Basically that led to that June, afternoon or day or morning when you woke up and were like, okay, I'm really trying. I'm going for it. Like no more. I'm sick,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I feel like 2024 was the year where like I started really questioning it. I tried to do dry January and I failed very quickly.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah, I.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734I, yeah, there was like no way like, it, it wasn't even an option. So. I tried that and then I started, you know, trying to do other challenges, like calling them other things like, oh, like mocktail may or something. I was like just trying to go time without alcohol and I was realizing like I really couldn't do it. Like I was, I couldn't really make it through. I had started looking, into sober coaching. It was actually funny. I had met my sober coach and I had like a whole meeting with her scheduled in like about April-ish, and I was like. Had it all scheduled, planned and then it came around and I was like, no, I can't do this. Like, I don't have a problem. I'm fine. I'm gonna cancel it. And I remember like, you know, canceling it electronically and just being like, I can't do this. And then I think I went to go visit my best friend in, it was about April May-ish. And we also, we just got totally hammered. Like we wasted our whole, like, I came all the way down from Buffalo down to New York and like we were hung over half the weekend. I was like, what am I doing? So like, all these things started just. Kind of like making a list in my head. And then, you know, things started just, I escalate, I continued to drink, you know, daily almost daily at least. And then in June, I don't know what happened. I just started like really thinking about stuff. And it was Father's Day. That's when June 16th was that day. It was I work overnight shifts, so I had gotten home. And I went to the store and I got like bacon and donuts and orange juice and a bunch of stuff to have like breakfast with the kids and you know, my husband and everything. And I realized like about maybe an hour and a half in like the whole container of orange juice was gone because I was drinking it with vodka and I like had just poured myself like a full drink and I was like. My kid was like, one of my sons was saying something and I'm like, what is he even talking about? I'm like, what am I, like, what am I doing? Like what, what am I doing? Why am I drinking vodka at 9:00 AM Like, what am I doing? And I just jumped my drink out and I was like, I, this is, this is ridiculous. I can't keep doing this. So, I mean, I don't really think it was a nest. Necessarily a rock bottom. Just more of like, if I keep doing this, like yeah, like I'm going to have a rock bottom. Like Yeah. Like one of those things. Yeah. I'm gonna end up somewhere, you know, I'm gonna have a DUI, I'm gonna lose my job. One of those things will end up happening if I keep going down this route.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733more like an awakening.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733that, like, oh, well, I can see myself clearly for the first time in a long
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733I don't recognize myself, like, what am I doing? That's powerful.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733powerful. I'm so glad that you had that moment and. What was your immediate like response? Did you start telling people, because I hear different iterations or different responses,. Personally, I did a combination of isolating for preparation, which is the opposite of what they say to do. Like you should seek connection, but like I needed to kind of process other people or immediately, like telling people that they know. So I'd love to learn like, what did you do? Like what did
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Did you rebook that meeting with your sober coach?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, immediately I, she like tells the story all the time now about like how I, I, you know, first reached out and go yeah, ghosted her. I told my husband right away because like, pretty much, like I said, I had been trying to do dry January and Mocktail May, and like it was not successful. So like I had to just be real with him and I was like, I don't think I can moderate, like this is not an option. Like I think I just need to. Stop drinking. And he was very supportive. Like he didn't really know what it was going to mean. He was like, well, so like, do I have to stop drinking?
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734And I was like, no. Like, you know, but like he was just like, I'm here for you in whatever way. And I tried to keep it kind of on the down low, I guess, with other people just because like I was afraid I'd fail, and make a whole big thing. But it just ended up like ending, like coming out. Naturally, like I, I went out to dinner. I remember I was trying to go out with some friends and I ordered like a non-alcoholic beer, and it was like a special effects, like it was called that.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah, I.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, the Brooklyn one. Yeah. And so I was like, oh, can I have a special effects? And the person was like, oh, the non-alcoholic one. And I'm like, and I'm like, I'm with my friends. And they're like, look at me. And they're like, are you pregnant again? And I'm like, oh my God, no. Thank God no. And then so I had to kind of tell 'em a little bit 'cause they were like, oh, you're having another kid? I was like, no, please God, no.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733No guys.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733am, I'm coming out. I'm
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733It's happening.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yes. So, I mean, it was a little bit of a combination, but, you know, I, I kind of had to tell people because of the circumstances I was in, you know? And then like I went to go visit my parents my dad and stepmother who live in Iowa and like we normally would've been drinking tons of champagne and stuff, and I was like, don't buy that. So I kind of was like, 'cause I was like, oh, maybe I shouldn't tell them. But my sober coach actually was like, well then what if. They expect all of this from you. And I was like, oh, that's a good idea. So I kind of told people as it, you know, came as it came out, like as I needed to as well. Like kind of and then, I don't know, it was sometime around five months sober that I was like, I wanna make an Instagram. Since like, I had seen other people who had 'em. And I was like, you know, why not? Like I, I wanna, tell people my story, you know, like I said, if it helps one person, it's worth it. It's worth
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733it is so worth
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734it. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733yeah, I think the realness about even like telling the people that are closest to you so that they can support you and set them up for success. Because I, I realized that so much of my identity was tethered to drinking. So like I was the person that people would buy alcohol for, like. My birthday for Christmas, like, I get wine, not socks, like, you know, like
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733merch. Like, I, I just had to like be honest and upfront. And then I think there's so something so true too that you mentioned just about like you have declared it before and, and failed, like there is, at least for me, there was this sense of apprehension, like, oh crap, here we go again. Like,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733tell people again. I'm trying. But I think the key distinction is like. Admitting when you mentioned to your husband like, I don't know if I can do this by myself, like I don't know if I can moderate. That vulnerability lends itself to people understanding and really being able to show up for you and support you through that process. And then I think, yeah, like the obvious response for most people, at least the people closest to me when I would tell them that I wasn't drinking and I was like, seriously trying this time and doing all of the things is yeah, what does that mean for me? Like, do, does that mean I don't have to drink? I. I was like, no. Like, do you, that's fine. But I wasn't in a relationship and I certainly wasn't married
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733that time, so I would love to learn, like did your relationship with your husband change at all? Was that awkward for you if he did continue to drink during that period when you were like transitioning into sobriety?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, that's a great question. 'cause we literally met in a bar like we, you know, I know most people meet online, but we actually met in real life at a bar.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Walked into a
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734So, yeah. But honestly. He never had as like issues moderating like I did, like I remember years, like, you know, he would be like, oh, you have to nurse your drink and, you know, just, you just have to drink slower and then like, you'll be fine. And like, no. So he is, he is.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733like
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734like, I don't understand what that means.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734No. So it's not really been too much of a challenge just because like he can, nah, he's a magical person who can moderate somehow. I don't know. But, I feel like it definitely changed things a bit in the beginning, but then I kind of found my own alternatives. So I kind of really got into like the non-alcoholic drink space. So I found my own beer, you know, my non-alcoholic beers and you know, mocktails and stuff like that. So then, you know, I kind of like have my own stuff, like when, you know, he opens his drinks. I have my own thing there. I mean. I don't enjoy it if people start getting too drunk. There's definitely like a limit where I could be around people who are drinking. You know, and I think everybody has their own limit, but I feel like it doesn't really get there. Thankfully, you know, that it's not been a problem in our relationship because, you know, he doesn't usually get to that point. But I could definitely see it being an issue if like, you know, that was your biggest form of, you know, connecting.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733think, I mean, for me, I've shared publicly before, like I had never had sex for the first time with someone without drinking. And like honestly, I probably could count on one hand how many times I had sex in a relationship completely sober. Like on nothing. Like what, even
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733long-term relationships, like that was my source of Everything. Like I really deeply over relied on alcohol to go there. whether that be go there intimately or just go there and like, think I needed that to have fun and let loose, like all of that. So like I think that is a huge like shift for people in the beginning. Especially like you mentioned
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733one person, one partner in the relationship is no longer drinking. But I think like the key is that the other person needs to a respect that other person's sobriety, but also like they can't have. same level of issue with alcohol. I personally believe for it to
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733to grow and work because at a certain point as you nurture your sobriety, you'll get to this place where you're like, you're sick of it. Like, I can go out and be around people drinking, no problem. But to your point, if people are sloppy and drunk, like, yeah, I can give you grace, but if it's a consistent, every time I hang out with you, you're, you're fucked up or you're completely gone. It's like, okay, this is not fun for me
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, they probably won't even, they probably don't even remember it either.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733No. Exactly. Exactly. And like, don't get me wrong, like I, I've, I've been, I was that girl. So like,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Oh yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733give people grace, truly but at this point it's like we have to be responsible for ourselves. I'm not here to babysit. I'm here to have fun. And if I feel like it's turning into that where. the person is completely inebriated. I just feel like it forces me to have to consider the relationship. So I, I love that you and your husband have gotten to this place and it sounds like you've found your own lane. You have your own recipes and your own, like rituals that you create when it comes to drinking, because I think that's another piece to it. It's not fun to always. Be sip
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733everyone else has a, a nice sparkly whatever beverage and their beautiful glassware. Like we want to also feel like we have something that we can also show off and enjoy.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733And so yeah. Thank you for sharing all of
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah. Yeah. I mean, honestly, yes, the intimacy thing is a huge thing. Like I also, the first time I ever drank alcohol was the first time I ever had sex, so very similar. So I, like I said, I'm lucky that I was in a relationship, like one of my best friends is, you know, sober and dating right now, and I know it's a huge challenge. Sober dating. Yes. I know. I haven't, I haven't read the book, but I know there's the dry humping, you know, Tana Tawny. Yes. Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733on this, on the podcast. Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733about it, and I think, I mean, truly, like, I mean, this is February, so Valentine's Day is
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733I'm, I'm sober and single and dating, and I, I have been talking to someone consistently for the past few months, but like, he's not my boyfriend. And I think for me it's like. it's just the biggest piece that I was missing, and Tani talks about this in her book, joy Humping. The biggest piece I was missing was like the self-love piece
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733if you are not comfortable with loving yourself and that even includes masturbation, like that even includes like just being comfortable in your own body and your own vessel, then it really can be awkward to
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733someone else into the mix. And so I had to like date myself first is
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733a big part of the book is like even if you are in a relationship. You kinda have to date yourself. You have to get to know and relearn parts of who you are without the substance.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Oh yeah. And I feel like it took time too. Like, I mean, I feel like right now I'm starting, like now I'm about almost, I'm almost 600 days alcohol free. I can't remember when it'll come up, but soon. And yeah, I mean it didn't, you know, like it was definitely very awkward still in the beginning with my husband, you know, like intimate wise, like for sure. 'Cause. Definitely alcohol was something that was, you know, a big part of everything. But it eventually, I feel like, you know, he joked around, he'll be like, oh, you're getting your groove back.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yes,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734You know, it'll come back.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733it definitely comes back
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734I feel like it's honestly probably coming for the first time because, I mean, I was started drinking and doing all this when I was 15, so I, I never actually learned how to do any of that on my own.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Amen.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733And truly like I've been celibate. I would say celibate, but like, it's not that intentional. Like I'm not like out here like waiting for a marriage. I just haven't had sex in over a year, because like I can't force connection anymore. Like I used to use alcohol to like. Force myself into liking the guy enough to open my legs. Like I,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733very like, just direct
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah. No.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Like I can't force those connections like, I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733actually like you now. And so it takes longer for me to like people
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733I've been patient with myself but like, yeah, I think that's a key piece too. It's like, yeah, getting your groove
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733just learning. More about yourself and what you like and like,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733have had the best sex since getting sober ever in my life and achieve the best orgasms from sobriety because like, I'm not numbing myself
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yep.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733literally.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733is like anesthesia in the sense like you, you think that you're turning and activating things, but actually, like I am repressing some of the sensors down there.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733everything just like feels so much more,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yep.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Alive and functional and, yeah. I can't wait to have sex again.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733more I talk to you
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733I'm like, yeah, I'm ready to have sex again.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Valentine's Day, hopefully.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733sex is amazing. Okay, so what's something that's actually surprised you, Kristen, from getting sober that maybe you weren't expecting?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734I think, yeah, like just realizing that I can socialize. Sober. You know, I feel like I relied so much on alcohol and I thought that alcohol was doing the work, but it really wasn't, you know, I think it was just giving me the confidence to just be myself,
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yep.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734you know? So I'm realizing now like, oh, okay. Like I am funny. I'm just shy. I just have to like, you know, get past the initial shyness and, that's normal. That's just being a human being.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733you're probably funnier now
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733we think we're hilarious when we're drinking and it's like, actually that wasn't,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, actually you're kind of a bitch.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733times. It's, yeah, it's a social lubricant, alcohol, like, it, it can ease you into feeling this false sense of confidence. But that's the thing, like it's not.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734It's not real. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733and then when you really can show up as your authentic self without that liquid courage, I think that is so much more pure. And with time, it's muscle too. You kind of have to like practice because. Being social can be
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Oh yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733why so many people drink. And so once you remove that safety net or that crutch, it forces you to keep practicing and Yeah. Something I realized about myself actually is I first started the Sober Butterfly as a, a play on many different things like. Obviously butterflies, they undergo metamorphosis. And so like I was transitioning into the sober lifestyle and space. And then on top of that, my friends always in college would refer to me as like, and throughout my twenties as like the social butterfly. And I had quote all of these friends and knew all of these people and was always on the scene. But actually I am not as social as I thought. I was like, I'm
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Hm mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733as I believed I was. It was the alcohol and personally I. Even thought back to like as a child growing up, I mean, I'm an only child. I was very shy,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah. Me too. Same.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733So like, that, that is actually more like true to who I am. And so I was, I realized in getting sober, actually I'm not as social as I thought I was, and that's okay.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah, yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734yeah. And that's actually like, so you know, I'll, I'll plug myself here. So that's another thing. So I'm looking at creating kind of like a sober community in my area because Yeah, it is super awkward. I know, like I went to a sober social, about five months into when I was sober and I was so awkward, like I couldn't even answer like, questions about myself. I was like, who am I? Yeah. Like, who am I? So yeah, so I mean, I wanted to kind of come up with something to kind of, you know, encourage socializing and mingling. So Queen City sober is like a, an an in-person. Group in Western New York, a community that were creating opportunities to network and mingle and socialize without alcohol. So a couple of weeks ago we had like a, we did human bingo. So it was like, yeah, I, I saved one here. So it was like this little thing, and it's like little squares, like, so like, yeah, so like, fill out, if, you know, if you meet one of the squares, like you'd fill out your name and like the goal was. Yeah, so I had some, so one, the first one here is has not been on social media today, so you had to find someone who has not been on it, fill it out, has run a 5K or longer, has at least two pets. We had only child on here. That was one of them.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733There we go.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Just like a variety of different ones that you can kind of like get to know people, like has been on tv, prefers tea over coffee, just like a variety of different questions. Just so like to encourage people to chat because I feel like it is very intimidating to just like be in a room and it's like, what do I do? What do I do with my hands?
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733you? Tell me everything about you. And also, like, I, I don't, I'm not a fan of small talk, so I love something like that because it's like, first of all, I prime someone. It's like, okay, I have this that I can refer to and it's gives me an in.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733then like, I'm sure the conversation takes on many
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Right? Yeah. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733conversation, like, you know, we started talking about sober sex. Like that was
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733the outline today, but
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734And there was a, a prize for the winner. So there was like a goal for winning. So yeah, if you it was a gift card to the facility. The, we, it was the Rooted Cup. It's like this little shop that does like tea and coffee, flights and stuff like that, A sober space. So it was a gift card to the place we were at. So I was like, at least there'll be a little incentive to play, you know.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733I love it. That's amazing. Yeah. Human bingo. I'm gonna do like human video. Find someone who has never had sober sex before.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yes. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733who like, just to make
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Get Really? Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Yeah, that's, that's great. And I love what you're doing with Queen City. I think that's so needed that space just because I think there's more people out here. Maybe it's like law of attraction, just like telling myself there's more people out here who are sober, but like still with events. I feel like the event space, most people default to drinking and then even as a sober person that wants to be social, to your point, it can be awkward.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733when you have these things that are designed and set up for people who are sober and want to socialize and then you have games and things like that to encourage them to be more social, that is like next level. I love that.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733other events coming up in
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734I don't, oh, we don't have it planned fully yet, but we are talking about doing salsa dancing, so that'll be Yes. So
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733that.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_3_02-08-2026_154734yes. So salsa dancing and some, you know, delicious non-alcoholic drinks to go with it.
the-sober-butterfly_3_02-08-2026_154733Perfect.
the-sober-butterfly_2_01-08-2025_164227And now a quick word from our partners.
the-sober-butterfly_25_12-24-2024_142305Okay, butterflies, let me let you in on a little secret. Self care is so much more than just bubble baths, it's about finding what makes you feel your very best, inside and out. And that's why I've been obsessed with ClassPass for years. Whether I'm crushing a Pilates class, getting a fresh blowout, or treating myself to a relaxing facial, ClassPass lets me explore all kinds of fitness and wellness options. With just one membership, I can book workouts, beauty treatments, and so much more all in one app. I've been a member since 2016, and I've booked over 500 reservations. ClassPass makes it easy and fun to prioritize my health and happiness all the while staying on budget. And because I want you to feel just as amazing as I do, I've got an exclusive offer for my listeners. Sign up with my special link and you'll get a free trial And 20 bonus credits to use toward any classes or services you want to try. So what are you waiting for? Take that first step toward feeling your best. Head to ClassPass to get started today.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Okay, Kristen, so winding down here. I would love to play a little fun game. Is that okay?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101It's called pharmacist versus Party Girl. Although you didn't
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Okay.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101yourself as a party girl, but like, I came remember this before, so like, okay. Just go with it for now. And you know what's so funny? Here I go on my tangent. I went to FAMU, Florida a and m University, which I'm not sure if you've heard of it, but it's a historically black college in Tallahassee, Florida. And I only cite that because we had one of like the best. Or like we graduate the most, black pharmacist nationwide
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102okay.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101even like, it's like
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102That's amazing.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101our pharmacy school was huge and I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Hmm. Okay.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101so many pharmacists and still do to this day, and I hate to generalize. So forgive me if this sounds ignorant, but. When I tell you the pharmacy school, the pharmacist went so hard
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101partying and they were like, I, I have my own story when it comes to drugs and like experimenting, but not in college. Like these,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101pharmacy school.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. There's probably more partying in like, you know, medical schools and dental schools and pharmacy schools just because of the stress. You know, the work hard, play hard, like, oh, you know, it gets so much on your brain and you know, but yes, yes, there was a lot of partying.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101that makes sense.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101sense. Or I was like, is it the fact that you guys understand the chemistry behind it?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102No. I mean, if we do, I mean that's, we're just playing, we're playing a dangerous game there. But I, I think I, I do think that yes, like pharmacists and, you know, physicians and stuff are just like, they think they have more control over drugs for sure. Yeah. Like, I know what I'm doing here, but, you know, no, I don't think that, I don't think that any of us know what we shouldn't be, you know, using drugs or alcohol that way For sure.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101like actually startling the number
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I'm like, oh no. They like, you get
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101they like to This day I'm in my thirties now and still I'm
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I know that person still likes to have a
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101like, I didn't know if that was like, if there was a parallel that was intentional, not Okay. Anyway,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102No, I, it's definitely common 'cause like I like that was a big part of like, when, that was the fun part of my drinking story. The partying that before it got really dark, that's where it was fun. But yeah, like there was a lot of, of drinking and partying in, in pharmacy school and I think there is more than you'd think, more, you know, maybe not as frequently, but like more intense when they do it.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101yes,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102know, like I said, you gotta like get it all in. It's like, oh, you know, we have to study, so, you know, work hard, play hard.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Quite
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101another thing is like when we graduated, like for our pharmacy school, I think like between undergrad, I don't know if this is standard, but like basically they would graduate with their master or their doctorate in pharmacy within six years.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101were graduating
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101they would have. more money than I did when I first
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Have like the penthouse in Miami and we'd go there and I'm like 22 and they're like maybe 24 and like the, it was, maybe it was access and fast
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101next level
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah, I, um, it's not really like that as much anymore. It, it kind of takes longer now. Like it, they've added a lot more like prerequisite, so usually it's like more of an a, wait,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101or
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102no, I did, I did it in six years as well, but, uh, like that I graduated like about 11 years ago. So, but like since that time it's kind of really been like, yeah, like a little bit lengthier. But yeah, I, I, I think, um, yeah, that oftentimes you do kind of,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101not generalizing, I'm not stereotyping, like this is like, it's a thing.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101'cause I'm like, I'm like nine out of 10 pharmacists. I know. And I know like maybe 20,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101is a lot.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I like to have a great time and maybe that's changed, but for most of 'em I'm like, I don't think it has.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101okay. So back to the pharmacist versus party girl game. I'm gonna say a scenario to you and then I would like for you, Kristen, to answer, what you would have done when you were drinking versus what you would do now.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Okay,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Okay,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102so starting.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101with had a bad day at work, I think this one's pretty obvious.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101you have done drinking versus what you would do now? Sober.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Um, well, obviously before I would've, I would've definitely started drinking as soon as I got home from work. Now that I'm sober, I try really hard not to take things as, as serious, you know? I mean, I know that's like. Easy to say, but I really try to practice Mindfulness a lot more. And then just finding different ways. So journaling is a big one for me. That kind of helps me like get out like some of my aggression or just listening to music. That's kind of another way that kind of helps, like ground me. It's just listening to different music. And then like oftentimes just like, I don't know, just doing like a round of self care and that literally like could mean like taking a shower, brushing my teeth. 'cause um, when I was drinking a lot, like. Brushing my teeth was like not a thing I cared very much about.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Did you ever read like a woman, because she talks about
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yes, yes, yes. So now I'm much more focused on that sort of stuff. So like, I mean, I feel like if I'm like really angry and then I like wash my face and brush my teeth and like, I don't know, I feel like a lot better. I feel like I like calm myself down a little bit. So.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101My nighttime routine was like almost nonexistent before, and I took. Everything for granted. Like I would, I can tell you, I would never really wash my
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101my makeup off because I would mostly pass out, or
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101wake up and at like 2:00 AM too,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101be like, oh yeah, I'm gonna like do a six step like
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. Just like one makeup swipe here. Yeah. Like that's good enough.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I'd be lucky if, yeah, I got the makeup, makeup or whatever on my face. But, um, yeah, I, I have white pillow cases now.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I'm sober. 'cause I'm like, yeah, I can like really enjoy white pillowcases. I would never have dared to have white pillowcases before.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Um, okay, so I'm updating the game because I feel like anything I'm gonna say for what you would've done drinking, involved drinking.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101um, just more so you can focus on what you would do now sober unless you would've done something differently. Okay. So what would you have done girls night out? drinking versus now that you're sober, so drinking, I'm assuming you would drink,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101the example
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. Drinking, but I mean, honestly I probably would've like pre-gamed a lot as well. So that's definitely like a big thing is like, I feel like I never showed up just sober. I was always several drinks in before I ever showed up anywhere.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101same.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Um. When you
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101when you have social anxiety, it's like, how am I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102show up.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Like I
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101drink obviously
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102and getting ready too, like, I, I don't know. Like I, I remember like once in pharmacy school, like I, I remember I got ready, I, I don't know how I got ready. Like honestly, I was so drunk, like, how did I have makeup on my face? I couldn't tell you how it, how it happened. So now I take a little bit more pride in just like, you know, I'm not anything. I don't do make makeup any fancy sort of way, but just taking general care of myself. So, you know, putting myself together, picking out my clothes. Like before I didn't really like care. I feel like I just kind of grabbed stuff. I was more like depressed. So now I feel like I'm more, you know, actually trying to, Have the outside match the way I'm feeling inside, which is better. And now, you know, I'm focused on, you know, actually enjoying the time with my friends and talking to them and taking pictures for, you know, Instagram for sure.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Um. But yeah, no, I mean, I feel like I'm actually focused on talking to people and not like what's in my glass and like, oh, is, oh my God, you know, if we're splitting a bottle of wine, you know, how much did they take? Did, did I, is there gonna be enough for me? Should we get another one? Like, should I get a second one? Like,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101A
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102you know, the waitress is taking a while to come. Maybe I'll order two.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yes,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101bringing me back. It'd be like the waitress be like, do you want the glass? And I'd be like, we, we just need the bottle.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101and one other person, like, but I'm like, I'm not gonna play games with you.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101don't wanna wait for her to come. Just bring the
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah. So, so real and the pre-game thing. Yeah. I once pre-game to go to a Relay for Life event. So yeah, I,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101there was no, there was no bounds to like my pre-game.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Um, what about vacation mode? Do you take trips? Are you a vacationer? And
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102don't really take too many, uh, yeah, the seven and the 4-year-old, you know, it's a little bit of a challenge.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101That makes a lot of
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102but I mean, we did, like, I was about four months into my sobriety. And we went to visit my parents in Iowa.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Mm-hmm.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102so I took a whole big road trip and, yeah. Um,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101without
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yes.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101were younger even.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah, I don't even know. Yeah, it was, it was a lot. But, you know, basically before I would've really been just focused on, you know, drinking the whole time,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102and kind of like, yeah, well, not driving, but I mean, once I got there, um, you know.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I was gonna say, even I would've been driving, I would've been drinking in the car, not driving and
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Oh yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101been like, honey, you're
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Oh, yes.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101like sip on
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm. Yes,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Um, truly.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yes. Um, but no, I mean, I probably would've just been worried about drinking the whole time and, you know, like my parents taking care of my kids
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Mm-hmm.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102and like, I was more focused on just having a good time and making memories. But I probably would've just like offloaded my kids for a while while I was drinking on this vacation. So, I mean, not really the vacation. One would think of in the, you know, exotic beach sense, but
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101a, a reset
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101like decompress. Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. Um,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101it.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102but yeah, I, I feel like I've definitely been a lot more present for my kids, so,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I love that so
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Okay, we're gonna wind down. Wind down with a quick rapid fire
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102So.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101So, mocktail.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Hmm. Um, I love like muddled fruit, agave lime juice. Um, muddle that up, put some ice and then seltzer on top. It's just like delicious. Mm-hmm. And you can put, and you can, if you have like mint or stuff, then you can put that stuff in there too. I just never have anything fresh.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101And I feel like that doesn't require like much,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102No.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101to have some fruit,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah. You don't need like a real muddle or you could just use a spoon or something. You know? You don't wanna go crazy.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101have some too.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101nice as well. Like it's not like, this is mommy, mommy
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Uh huh. Oh, I know. They're always like, what do you have? Can I try it? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, you can actually.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101That's amazing. What about hardest part of early sobriety? First thing that comes to mind.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Um, honestly, well, so I feel like it was very interesting the phases of early sobriety. Like, I feel like right at first I was really, really tired. Like, I was just like, I feel like physically I, you know, I was really drinking a lot. So I think that, you know, physically I was recovering, but like, I feel like it felt good. And then there was like a low where like everything was terrible. I feel like where all the emotions kind of started like. Coming back to life
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102like that was really tough. That like thawing out period. You know, and there was just so much. Yeah, so much like, oh my god.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101is this pink cloud
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101talking about?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102well, I mean, I had like a really quick one. I'm like, oh, this is great. And then I was like, oh, well now I feel everything, and like, what do I do? I this, I would've drank about this before. So that was very challenging. Like I said, I was in a sober group, so that helped me a lot. So like, I relied, I relied a lot on other people. So, you know, I think that was the biggest thing is like finding people who, you know, could support you,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102support me. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101And what do people say when you tell them you don't drink
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Um,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101responses you mostly hear,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102um hmm. Honestly, at this point, I mean, a lot of people know at this point,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101yeah,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Most of the times, like, I feel like people don't really care as much as like you think. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. Like I, I also have like young children around me all the time, so I feel like people are like, well, why would you be drinking so much?
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102You know? So, but yeah, like I, I think that, I feel like I was so nervous about it, like about admitting it, and then I realized like. Most people don't care. And if, and if they are getting upset, it's mostly, it's probably something about them, like they feel a certain type of way. Um, you know, I have had a few people kind of like, I don't know, like I've ordered like a non-alcoholic beer and maybe they passed a little judgment, but I feel like, like once they start talking to me a little bit and it's like they realize like, oh, well I'm not judging you for drinking. Like, I don't care. Like, I just don't want that. Then like, they tend to soften up a bit.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Agreed. I feel like anytime someone has a real reaction aside from, oh cool, there's something else going on that has nothing to do with me. And when you mention your friend who is talking about the struggles of sober dating, I think that's a big part of it too. When you go on these dates with these men who claim that like they don't care and then they do somehow care
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101think that you're joking when you say you don't
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I think that's like the part where it's like. Eyebrow raise? Like, like why, why would you
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I don't care that you are drinking. Unless it becomes a problem
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102But I, I understand because I would've been that person too. Like I 100. Yeah, exactly. Like I remember, like, I would definitely have made fun of like, I would've made fun of me. Like I would've been like, why are you drinking non-alcoholic beer? That's a waste of time. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102I would've been a jerk.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Problem.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102I guess. Yeah. Like not, I would be like, what's the point? You know?
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Yeah. Like why are you here again?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101invited
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101What?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102But clearly I had a problem, so that's where it was coming from.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Times have changed, but maybe that's still like me just like excusing my terrible behavior because I'm like, yeah, I was younger. And I do think there's a bit of a paradigm shift in society. More people are open to sober, lifestyles. But yeah, I was definitely the dick that was like, who wants a shot?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah, yeah, yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101whatever. yeah. That's that's fair. That's fair. Okay. Last question. What is, one thing you think moms need to hear about alcohol?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102It really does not make parenting easier despite what they are trying to tell you. It does not. So, yeah. I mean, yeah, it's great to take the edge off for in the moment, but like everything's terrible afterwards. It's not fun to parent hungover. It's the worst thing in the world.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101It is,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101it is. And not to like, you know, scare people. Once again, not a mom, but imagine if your kid needed
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Mm-hmm.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101for some reason and you couldn't be there, like you're physically there, but you can't be
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101capacity that they need.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I listen to a lot of True Crime podcasts, but like, this is not helpful. But I'm like, yeah, someone broke in
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I'm passed out on the
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101but I put the kids to bed. It's like I, yeah,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102and I, and I was like, one of the, like, I would pass out, like my husband would be like trying to like move me and stuff and like, nope, I was not going anywhere. Like, and I would just put all the pressure on him. Like, I would just be like, oh, hopefully no one comes in and murders everyone. 'cause you're, you have to take care of everyone.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Your responsibility now. Okay.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I had them in like nine to five. Now it's on you.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Um, yeah. Yeah, that was me. That, that was me too. Not with kids obviously, but yeah, I, anyone could have. Broken and I've been like, okay, well I'm just a sleeping target.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah, yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101Um, so thank you for being so honest and open and vulnerable with us. Just so relatable in so many aspects. seriously Kristen. So thank you also for like creating your platforms. I'm going to just open up, I know that you have Queen City Sober as well. I know people can find you on Instagram under the Alcohol Free
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Alcohol for Alchemist. Uh. Yeah.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101to me. Chemist.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yes,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I like
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102yes,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101the Alchemist. Is there anything that you wanna share or plug for folks as we wrap up right now?
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102No, I mean, like I said, I, you follow me on my Alcohol Free Alchemist account, I like to post like recipes, reviews of non-alcoholic drinks and then, you know, my community Queen City sober and we're in the Buffalo, New York, uh, Niagara Falls area. But yeah, you know, hoping to find more opportunities to do events like we just got started, so, but I'm very excited for, for the future and getting people together 'cause. It's been great. Just like connecting with people in the community.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101If you ever wanna do like a joint collab, um, like obviously with some planning in the future, like I would be game to do
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101here or like, I can come up to Buffalo. I flew to Buffalo once for a, a same day passport,
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Oh,
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I've been to Buffalo.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102okay.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101a crazy situation. So like, yeah, easy flight
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Yeah, like I said, my, I'm from originally from New York, like downstate, so I'm like down there all the time. 'cause my friend's in Staten Island, so I'm always down there. She's like, come down here for this time. This? Yes.
the-sober-butterfly_4_02-08-2026_161101I love it. Thank you so much for coming on, and I will plug everything below in the show notes so people can connect with you.
kristin-martinez--she-her-_4_02-08-2026_161102Great. Thank you so much.
the-sober-butterfly_6_02-23-2026_083318Wow. Kristen's story is such a powerful reminder that sobriety doesn't always start with a dramatic rock bottom. Sometimes it just starts with a quiet realization, a moment where you recognize that you wanna be more present, more connected, more aligned with the life you are actually living. What I love most about her journey is how relatable it is. The anxiety, the exhaustion, the normalization of drinking, the pressure of mommy wine culture, and the courage it takes to pause and ask, is this actually helping me or hurting me? Nearly 600 days later. Kristen isn't just alcohol free, she's more present with her kids, more connected to herself, and she's creating community for other people through Queen City Sober and her platform, alcohol Free Alchemist, which is incredible to see. If you're listening and questioning your own relationship with alcohol, I want you to know this. You don't have to wait until things get worse to decide you want something better. Awareness is enough curiosity is enough. You are allowed to change. If this episode resonated with you, please share it with a friend, especially another mother or a woman who might need to hear that. Alcohol doesn't actually make life easier, it just delays the healing. You can find Kristen and connect with her community using the links in the show notes. As always, thank you for being here. Thank you for choosing growth and thank you for being a part of the Sober Butterfly community. I will see you this Friday where I'm going to be sharing a lot about what went down in Dubai because it was an amazing trip. So stay tuned for this Friday's episode. I love you guys. See you Friday.