From Stoner Girl to Sober Girl: How Harm Reduction Made Sobriety Possible for Ashley McGee

Ashley McGee shares her journey of overcoming the influence of various substances, including alcohol, cigarettes, vaping, and weed. Ashley talks openly about the impact these substances had on her life, why harm reduction was crucial for her, and the tools that aided her in achieving sobriety. 

We Also Discuss...

• Ashley's identity shift, from stoner girl to sober girl.
•  The role her sober boyfriend played in her journey, and the importance of positive examples of sober people having fun.
•  Community and practical tools in maintaining sobriety.
•  Why harm reduction is a valid path towards sobriety.

Connect with Ashley 💗

• Instagram: @alcoholfreeash 

Connect with Nadine and TSB 🦋

• Instagram: @the.soberbutterfly @soberbutterflypodcast
•  YouTube:@thesoberbutterfly

Sponsors/Partnerships

Classpass
https://classpass.com/refer/MQ30HIPH11

exclusive free trial (with 20 bonus credits!)

Audible

Free 30 Day Trial

https://www.audibletrial.com/tsb24

Thanks for listening! New episodes available every Friday.
 
 Please follow the show and leave a 5 ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ review! 

Transcript

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-30-2025_081148: 0:02

If you have ever struggled with alcohol, cigarettes, vaping, Or weed, or just questioned your relationship with any of them. This one is for you

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-30-2025_081454: 0:15

Today, I'm joined by the incredible Ashley, who's approaching one year alcohol free and has been navigating her own unique path to sobriety.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-30-2025_081148: 0:25

Ashley is keeping it so real about her journey. She breaks down how each substance impacted her life. Why harm reduction was key to her success and the exact tools that helped her break free.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-30-2025_081454: 0:38

Whether you have tons of sober time or you're in your first year of sobriety, or even just thinking about cutting back, this episode is going to hit home. Let's get into it.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 0:53

Hello, hello and welcome back to the Sober Butterfly, your go to podcast for navigating sobriety, celebrating the alcohol free lifestyle and having some laughs along the way. I'm your host, Nadine, and today I'm so excited to be joined by a very special guest, Ashley welcome to the Sober Butterfly. How are you?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:14

I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:18

I'm so excited to have you here. And we have so much to dive into today. But before we get to like the heart of your story, let's warm up with some fun questions so that folks at home can get to know you better. Are you ready?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:31

Yes let's do it

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:34

So my first question for you, Ashley, is what was your go to drink during your partying days?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:42

Oh God. Probably a vodka soda, which is like so basic and lame, or a good espresso martini. If I'm like being fancy. Ha

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 1:52

I feel like those are both classics. I was a big espresso martini girl. So like now in sobriety, what's your go to non alcoholic drink?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 2:03

I do love a good sour beer. So we have a, I think it's a local Toronto brand called Bellwoods Brewery. Oh, I have a hard time saying that. And they do a really great sour. They have like three different flavors. I also really like Untilted Arts sour beer. They have like a dragon fruit passion. Or dragon fruit, mango, something along those lines. And it's really, really good. And I also just randomly tried Mavericks martini dupe for like a passion fruit, I think vanilla. And that was actually really good as well. So I got to try more of Mavericks

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 2:36

Adding to my list. okay. Let's move with the next question. What's the wildest thing you've ever done while drinking that you can laugh about now?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 2:45

Oh, God. one time I accidentally went to the wrong apartment building the apartment building next to mine and I accidentally thinking it was my apartment and I couldn't get in banged on the door like three in the morning. This poor old woman. Was living there and called the police because she thought I was trying to break into her house. And then I passed it in the hallway, which is obviously both dangerous and funny. But like, looking back now, it's funny because like nothing really bad happened, but obviously could have gone a different way. But yeah, I scared this poor old woman.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 3:13

You scared this poor lady, but the thing is yeah, to your point, like it could have gone wrong or more wrong in a million and one ways, but I can just imagine like the conviction you had, like, why can't I get in my apartment, like, just banging down this poor woman's door?

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 3:30

Literally. And I had a roommate, which is why I was trying to bang, trying to get her to like open the door for me. But no, this poor sweet old woman just thought I was trying to break in

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 3:39

well, I'm so glad that, you know, everything worked out and you're safe and I'm sure that woman is probably laughing when she got over the shock and horror. She laughed about it too.

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 3:49

I hope so.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 3:49

I'm sure she did. and then my last getting to know you quick question is I would love to know what's a drinking habit or ritual that you thought was totally normal, but looking back was actually a red flag.

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 4:05

Honestly, probably just like not being able to stop. Like just. Getting to that point of blackout like, you know, you start with one even on a Sunday fun day having one or two drinks Then you're like, let's keep going and I realized that that's not normal for a lot of people But for me it was it definitely was yeah

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 4:25

Yeah, I can relate to that. I think, too, like, pre game culture, pre gaming, before I went out for anything, and the thing that I was normally going out to involved drinking, so it's like, why did I feel the need to pre game before the event where there's tons of booze? Like, that, to me, is just insane. about how I would pregame for the bar, pregame for brunch, pregame for boozy brunch, by the way, pregame for events that you didn't need to pregame for like quite literally a baby shower. So yeah, fun times, fun times. I really appreciate you sharing that with us. And I'm so excited now to dive more into your story, Ashley. What was like that turning point for you where you realized, okay, and I want to frame this under alcohol because I feel like this conversation is going to lead to many different things. you know, substances,

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 5:18

different things. Yeah.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 5:19

different things, right? So I want to start with alcohol. Like, at what point did you have that realization that enough is enough? I'm done with alcohol.

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 5:27

So, I mean, I feel like I kind of got sober curious, should we say? Starting in like, 2022 maybe I mean there had been so many times I texted with my friends saying like, oh my god I can't keep drinking like this. This is killing me. Like this is a brutal hangover Like I I'm never drinking again kind of a thing But I never really meaned it and I never really gave it more thought than that until around 2022 and that was kind of the height of my drinking and like the last five years or so I was going out every weekend. I was blacking out most weekends. I was spending every day infinite amounts of money going out, going to the liquor store, all of these types of things. But I never really thought I could get sober. I just thought I needed to, you know, moderate, which I think everyone thinks is the first stuff that they need to do. and then it was, In March of last year, so 2024, I had gone out with my boyfriend and a couple of friends, and I distinctly remember texting him that night saying like, I don't want to drink a lot tonight. and lo behold, of course I did. I did not remember getting home. I'm pretty sure I was sick. I woke up with the most brutal hangover. And that next day was just the first day when I was like, I think enough is enough. Like I really just can't keep doing this to myself. Um, and so that was about 10 and a half months ago and I haven't had a drink since, which I love.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 6:55

I really so much of that as well. Just kind of being sick of being sick that will do it sometimes like you don't always have to have this quote rock bottom. to recognize that a change needs to happen. And yeah, I think the insanity piece, for me at least, was I'm doing the same thing. I don't like what I'm doing. I recognize that something is wrong. I, I too wasn't ready to completely quit drinking when I started to like, really listen to that inner voice that I needed to change. So I also moderated or attempted to moderate, but yeah, it's just this idea of it. Like, I don't want to constantly be the, you know, brunt of people's jokes. So the person that's always like keys, wallet, phone, or banging on my neighbor's door at 3am, like the stories are limitless and that just got to a place or a point where I was just like, eh, something that's got to get, and thankfully. Alcohol was the thing that I gave up and I don't even like the framing of giving it up because it makes it seem like it's a loss or a deficit. And it's

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 7:58

We're gaining so much more.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-24-2025_165309: 8:00

exactly, so alcohol wasn't the only thing in your life or substance in your life that was sort of anchoring you. So talk to us a little bit more about what life looked like for you, Ashley, in conjunction with. Other substances, I'm curious to know what's a typical Thursday, Friday night in Ashley's life? Circa 2000, whatever, before you got sober.

ashley_2_01-24-2025_165309: 8:24

So for me, I started smoking weed probably when I was in university and I was a pretty daily weed smoker. like I would get high in the morning, afternoon, night, like nothing really could hold me back. And truthfully, I didn't feel like. Too much of me changed. Like I, I felt like I could get by for the most part. I was, you know, going to school. I was getting good grades. I had a job. All of these things that were pretty normal. and then I think when I was about 23, 24, I started mixing cigarettes with weed, which we call poppers here. And I don't know if that's what you guys call them there. but I started doing that. And then, um, Naturally, I started getting addicted to cigarettes as well. and so at first it was like a mixing of the two. And then slowly, not only was I mixing them, but I would also smoke cigarettes when I would go out, when I would drink and then also when I wouldn't drink, when I was just stressed and things like that. and so obviously that was a really bad habit to get into. and so So then it was maybe, I don't know, sometime during the pandemic basically, I was trying to date, doing all these different things, and you know, on your dating profile you have to say do you drink, do you smoke, do you smoke weed, all of these different substances. I'd be like coy and I would just like remove it from my profile and like people would ask me about it like oh I'm like no or only occasionally only when I drink something like that um but obviously people are stupid and they can smell it and they can taste it and it's something that lingers on you right so it was a very obvious lie and it made me embarrassed and like ashamed that I did smoke and I wasn't necessarily ashamed that I smoked weed but Maybe more so how much and I was worried about people judging me. Um, so then it was May 1st, 2023. So almost two years ago now. Actually a couple of years before that I switched from cigarettes to vaping because of that. All those people were like, kind of grossed out by the fact that I was smoking. So I was like, you know what, okay, I'm gonna switch to vaping. It's, you know, quote unquote, healthier, doesn't have that smell. I can do it anytime, anywhere, any place kind of a thing. And I was like, in the middle of the night, I'd wake up and I huff on my vape at like two in the morning, four in the morning and fall back over to sleep. But then, obviously, I was just kind of getting tired of all of it, and in 2023, I started dating my boyfriend who had gone through his own sobriety journey. He also smoked and drank and did all of these things, but all before I met him, and so when I met him, he was sober. and he didn't care that I did any of those things, but I don't know, just something about seeing him be sober. Made me, like, start thinking about my own things a little bit differently, and so it was in may 2023 may 1st I had stopped smoking cigarettes But I was still vaping still smoking weed and I was still drinking and on that day. I was like you know what? I'm gonna stop vaping. I was just Just realizing like how much money I was spending on it, how dependent I was getting on it, how freaked out I would get if I lost one or if one fell in the toilet when I was drunk or things like that, like it would ruin my entire night. And I don't know, I just felt like it needed to go. So it was like three days after my, I think 30th or 31st birthday. I don't even remember how old I am now. I just decided to quit. I was like, you know what? Once this dies, I'm just not going to buy a new one. and so I just, I didn't, it was honestly really, really hard. It was super irritable. I had to snack on so many candies. I eat so much gum. Things like being in my car would be irritating because of traffic. And like, that would be the place that I could just, you know, Smoke and vape and do all these things. And so that was like really hard for me. But at that time when I stopped vaping I was using the I am sober app because I wanted to start tracking you know, how long I could go for how much money I was saving all of these different things. And I also ended up starting to track my drinking at that time. So I just kind of wanted to see what it was like, like I had an idea of what it was in my mind. But in part, I feel like I needed some kind of concrete proof to either show that I was a normal drinker or wasn't a normal drinker. and so I realized that throughout all of 2023, I couldn't go more than like maybe five days without a drink. Like, I wasn't really a Monday to Thursday, Sunday to Thursday drinker. Um, but then Friday and Saturday I would always drink. Even if it was just one, which obviously wasn't very often, it was a lot of the time a lot of binge drinking. and I just, yeah, started realizing how negatively it was impacting like my overall life. Like I was getting in fights with my boyfriend over the stupidest things, things I would say that I wouldn't remember how I would act. And again, like I had been thinking about it for a whole year or two before, but I didn't really feel like I could make that choice to move forward until last year when I literally was just like, no, this is enough. I'm so tired of feeling like this. I was. I was done with being violently ill every weekend, not remembering things, spending money on Ubers and Uber Eats and shots at the bar for other people that I didn't even know or didn't even like or didn't even care about really. And yeah, so that brought me to my end of the time with drinking. Um, but then I was still smoking weed because again, I had been doing it for about 10 years at that point. And I, like earlier, I didn't feel like it. anything was negatively impacting me because weed is such a more insidious type of a substance. It gets to you in different ways that are maybe not as obvious as drinking. Um, so eventually I just started, the more I like was farther away from my alcohol use, the more I started realizing and looking at my dependency with weed and seeing it for what it was as well. And it was about Um, two and a half months ago now that I also decided to stop smoking and yeah, I, I will say I don't think I could have stayed like sober for not drinking if I hadn't been leaning on weed because I did really use it as a coping mechanism and I was really tied to it identity wise and I didn't want to feel like. I was completely changing and I was this whole new person and everyone would wonder where I was and why I was doing all these things. And I wanted to still feel like I had control over something and it gave me something to do when I would go out instead of drinking. And it still made me feel like a part of things, but then it got to the point when I realized I was leaning on it too heavily in the same ways that, you know, alcohol was holding me back. Weed was also holding me back and it was. Stunting my growth in certain ways, and I wasn't able to sit with certain feelings like boredom or sadness or anxiety. And I just kind of realized like I wanted to feel those things like I wanted to move past those and embrace it and feel like, you know what? No, I can do this on my own. I don't I don't need a crutch. I don't need a tether to continue holding on because I was at such a good place. My answer was such a good place with my You know, even when I have fleets of missing it, I'm like, nah, I don't really like when I really think about it and what it did for me. So yeah, now it's now I'm, I'm totally sober, but I definitely used a lot of different substances over like the past decade of my life to kind of get me through and numb and to have fun and to do all these different things. And now I know that, you know, fun can be had in a sober way.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 16:20

Same. I can relate so much, Ashley, to pretty much everything you shared, with the exception of the vape. I wasn't a vape girl, but weed, alcohol, tobacco, cigarettes specifically. Yeah. Sign me up. That was like my jam at different points in my life. I leaned on certain substances more, but I think baseline alcohol was my main drug of choice that would. lead me to worse outcomes. So like what I mean by that is in my mind, I was a functional marijuana user. Like I would smoke pretty much daily or take edibles. And I felt like it didn't alter my state of consciousness or It didn't completely change my personality in the same ways that alcohol did, because alcohol was such a mirror to like my inner, personality. feelings. So if I was repressing something or if I was trying to numb out and not feel the alcohol would unleash that. And then I would like lash out or I would just be belligerently drunk and sloppy. The whole tenure of my drinking, I didn't like losing the control, but I also wanted to black out. So I know that makes no sense,

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 17:33

I hear that. No, I totally understand. That me to a t. I get it.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 17:39

Right. I think I can just be such a control freak. So I almost like wanted to like, just be like, okay, I'm, I can just be completely uninhibited and I love that alcohol did that for me until it went too far and now I am not behind the driver's seat. So that part was scary. I was always chasing this, perfect equilibrium where it was, like, I can take a couple tokes of weed, and by the way, the weed and cigarette, um, what do you guys call it again? You call it poppers?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 18:05

I call the poppers, but I don't even know if that's everywhere

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 18:08

Okay. Is that a Canadian thing, or is it just, like, your terminology?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 18:12

I don't even know. Maybe it's like, I lived in London, Ontario at the time, so like maybe it was a London thing. Maybe it's a Toronto thing. I'm not really sure

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 18:18

Okay. Poppers here means something totally different. Poppers here, and I know it's from my gay friends, like you go to the gay club, a lot of people take poppers, and it's like, um, a concoction of different drugs that you inhale, and I want to say there's probably something in there, and it gives you like this head high, immediate head high, and it's also like, A sex drug.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 18:44

Not what I'm referring to.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 18:47

Here we would probably call it like a spliff or a blunt. I wanted to clarify. I was like, I know what you mean, but just in case. Oh, poppers. Oh, interesting. Um, Ash is doing poppers. No, not that kind of thing. But yeah, I would also mix my, my marijuana and my, tobacco and I would also feel the stigma interestingly from me smoking cigarettes than me smoking weed I felt that we was more socially acceptable so I would hide my tobacco intake because I didn't want people to think I was like gross, but I don't think I was probably hiding it that well because as we know tobacco lingers like that smell it pervades your clothes like your hair

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 19:25

Yeah it's everywhere.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 19:26

When you mentioned the contemplation phase that you went through where you were sober curious for like a year before you started to act. I think that's common too. And I also resonate with the idea of it, like removing, All at once can be really overwhelming, and I don't like to vilify or discriminate against people who are like, I'm going to start with this one thing, and if I decide to remove the other things, cool, if not, Maybe I'm not going to, or maybe I'm not ready to, and I think that's fine, because often times I think we can get too ahead of ourselves, maybe before we're ready, and that can actually lead to a relapse, or that can lead to more damage than good, so I'm with you there, like I think, You do things when you're ready to do them, and you have to, remove the judgment, and I say we, I just mean, like, as a community, we have to, exhibit more grace when it comes to meeting people where they are.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 20:27

100 percent

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 20:28

And it's a form of, what do you call that?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 20:31

Like harm reduction.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 20:32

Thank you, that's the term. I was thinking risk for some reason, like risk reduction. No, it's a form of harm reduction. And I think, there's still some stigma within the, recovery or sobriety spaces around, Oh, well, if you're not 100 percent sober, you don't deserve to use the term. And it's like, no, I'm working on it. I'm working on me. And I think starting with the thing that may be causing the most destruction is really helpful. And then checking in because to your point, it sounds like when you got rid of alcohol, you started there. It gave you clarity to start recognizing Other choices and other maybe coping, mechanisms that you were leaning on. So I resonate so much with what you shared.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 21:14

Yeah. Cause I hadn't actually planned to stop smoking weed until I had the space to even think about it. Right. Like, like you said, you're not ready until you're ready. And I wasn't ready yet. And then I did.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 21:28

Love that. And I like that your relationship with your boyfriend who is sober. it sounds like he was supportive and also served as a representation of what life could look like sober, like from a positive standpoint, because I'm assuming your boyfriend's still. a cool, fun guy, right? Sometimes we need representation. We need to see it to believe it, right?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 21:52

And that was exactly it. I didn't know anyone that was sober until I had met him like in real life. You know, I had, you know, you see celebrities on shows or even on Instagram, whatever. And it does feel inspiring when they're doing those things. and talking about it, but it's one thing to see it from afar and then another to see it in your real life and to see that. Oh, you know you can still go out. You can still have fun. You can still socialize. And that was something I just never thought fathomable until I had met him. And so yeah, it was in a way like both a mirror for me to see what my own drinking was like because no one had really questioned it before until I met him because everyone around me and in my circle, we all drink in similar ways. And so for him to not, it really highlighted the differences, you know, and so it also then, yeah, gave me like inspiration to see what life could actually look like and see him, you know, Stick to his workout goals and eat healthy, and, have all these consistent good routines that I was always trying to work on, but could never do because I was in a cycle of being hungover and sick and tired or drunk, truthfully. Like I said, he never pressured me in any way to do these things, but it was more just the inspiration of just seeing him live that I was like, Oh, wow. Seems like a nice way to be. I think I want to give some of these things to try myself. And it did take me a whole year into us dating to even get to that point too. Like none of these things just happened overnight. but yeah, he was definitely a big inspiration for me to see that you could still be young and cool and go out and have fun and like do all of these other types of things that I was still hoping to be able to do.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 23:44

Okay. I knew one person who was sober. In my age group and she was not cool. She was not cool. so for me, it was like, I don't want to be like that.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 23:55

Right. You're like, Ugh, I don't know if this is the life for me

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 23:58

All of the, Archetypes of sober people judging and being like, oh, like, what's in your cup? That's what I don't want to be and that's what she was and so I get it even when I go out and people find out that i'm sober I used to take it really personal when they would get all defensive or like, you know, interrogate me But now i'm like, oh no, it's an insecurity or it's maybe them projecting or questioning if they're drinking too much or if you're judging what they're drinking. It's like, I don't, I really don't care. Like I don't care if you want me to care, if you want me to like help or give you my two cents, sure. But otherwise like, do you, cause I've done, lived many lives before. So I've definitely done me. and so I get it that like, that was like the type of person that I knew, the only sober person that I knew. And I was like, yeah, no, thank you. Um, so this is why this is so important. Our stories, your boyfriend showing you like, Hey, life doesn't stop when you're sober. You don't have to become this boring version of self, but I want to go back to what you mentioned about like your identity being kind of tethered to marijuana, because. That is something that I haven't gotten into, on this podcast as much as I would like to,

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-08-2025_164227: 25:10

And now a quick word from our partners.

the-sober-butterfly_25_12-24-2024_142305: 25:15

Okay, butterflies, let me let you in on a little secret. Self care is so much more than just bubble baths, it's about finding what makes you feel your very best, inside and out. And that's why I've been obsessed with ClassPass for years. Whether I'm crushing a Pilates class, getting a fresh blowout, or treating myself to a relaxing facial, ClassPass lets me explore all kinds of fitness and wellness options. With just one membership, I can book workouts, beauty treatments, and so much more all in one app. I've been a member since 2016, and I've booked over 500 reservations. ClassPass makes it easy and fun to prioritize my health and happiness all the while staying on budget. And because I want you to feel just as amazing as I do, I've got an exclusive offer for my listeners. Sign up with my special link and you'll get a free trial And 20 bonus credits to use toward any classes or services you want to try. So what are you waiting for? Take that first step toward feeling your best. Head to ClassPass to get started today.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 26:30

in my mind, I. Rank substances differently. I am not saying that's what people should do. a substance is a substance. A vice is a vice. But the way in which I think I used marijuana, while it was especially towards the end of my using It did resemble similar patterns to how I used alcohol. I do think that it's different. and this is just my opinion, guys, this is just how I feel in this moment. I feel like a substance like marijuana is not as. detrimental to one's health in the same way, at least for me, because people respond differently. Let me be clear. People respond differently to different substances. My drug of choice was definitely alcohol. I was my worst version of self when I was drinking. I can't say that for out for marijuana. I cannot say I was the worst version of myself. Was I lazy? Yes. Was I less productive? Sure. were there moments when I leaned on marijuana as a way to maybe deflect from realities of my life. Sure. But I still don't think it held the same weight or the same impact in the ways that alcohol did for me. So how do you feel?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 27:36

100%. Yeah, I think I'm on the same wavelength as you. Like, I mean, for the longest time, I literally called myself a functional stoner. And like, I was proud of that. I had no shame about it. I would, Like I said, I would wake up and smoke. I'd smoke before I'd eat or do certain activities. I'd smoke around my friends. I'd smoke at home. And like, I still got on with my day, you know? Like, I'd still clean the whole house. I would read. Honestly, I would still run. I could run a 10k.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 28:07

Oh, I couldn't do that, but that's impressive.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 28:11

Like, for the most part, I was I was pretty like quote unquote normal and was doing normal things. I don't feel like it completely changed me in the way that obviously alcohol did and it didn't affect me in the same negative ways that alcohol did. But for me, I started realizing that similarly to alcohol, I just couldn't moderate, like I had only in over a decade stopped smoking once before. And it was cause I had to, I was moving abroad. There have been. To do a drug test when I moved and they had no weed there, like at all. So I was like, Oh, I literally cannot. Somehow though, I did have a friend who like snuck in a weed pen. Don't know how she did it, but she did. So I did get high a couple of times when I was there. And I remember thinking to myself when I was over there, like, wow, I'm so clear headed, like I can do all these different things when I go back home. I'm not going to fall back into those same patterns that I did before I left. and I didn't at first, you know, I was pretty okay moderating, but slow over time. I did start using more and more. It did start becoming an all day thing again. It was to the point where I couldn't eat unless I would smoke. I felt like I had to smoke to get through the day. Or if I was staying at my boyfriend's for the night and I wasn't prepared and I didn't have weed, I like we have to go get some like we're driving half an hour to the most open place like I will go at any cost to get it. And when I started evaluating What that actually meant and thought about it in relation to alcohol and the extreme lengths that people go to to get alcohol, how negative they feel if they don't have it, hiding it, all these different things. I was realizing I was doing the exact same thing with weed. And so while it might not have outwardly looked like I was a different person, I was still getting all of my shit done. I, Couldn't moderate. I was very dependent on it. And when I did stop, I purposely aligned it with when I was going on a vacation because I knew that I wouldn't have access to it there. I knew that I'd have jet lag, so it helped with my sleeping because I was really worried about withdrawals. And I knew I had to get out of my environment to like actually break the cycle of it because it was such a daily part of my routine. Wake up, roll a joint, go outside, have a coffee, whatever, get on with the next part of my day. And yeah, so for me, it wasn't that it necessarily like changed who I was or had all of these negative side effects, but it was more of an evaluation of my inability to moderate any kind of substance and how dependent I was becoming to it. And I just, I didn't want to feel that way anymore. I felt like I finally had enough like tools on my quote unquote toolbox to manage without it. But I did need that vacation to really help break that tether. For me, which I think you had mentioned in one of your, like, very first podcast, like you went on a vacation when you stopped drinking and getting out of your environment can really help. And so it did for me, luckily.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 31:23

People, places, things, routines, I had to remove myself from my normal ecosystem to enter into that next phase, to embrace a new lifestyle. when I travel. I'm like, Oh, I'm this new person. Like I'm this best version of self, or I'm going to like take on this persona. You know, you've packed a look. So you're like, who am I going to be on this vacation? And so, yeah, that's kind of what I needed to do because I was really struggling in New York. I literally went on a six week trip. I went to six different countries. So it was, it was fast paced. And some people find that traveling while sober can be triggering, but the inverse. for me happened, which was I distracted myself from my daily routine, and got out of the very ecosystem where my addiction thrived. So it was helpful to take that break. And then when I came back, I felt like I was more prepared to make a lasting change. And I think also interesting to what you shared is the mental fixation piece, I think, is so crucial in discerning whether or not a substance is A problem for you. Like what priority does it have in your life? I think by nature I have an addictive personality. I get super into things and I deluded myself for a very long time, very long time, because as mentioned before, I was like, Oh, well, marijuana is not as bad as alcohol. I'm not as bad on marijuana when I smoke or when I take an edible, I'm chill. I'm not breaking windows quite literally. I'm not blowing up my ex boyfriend 15 times, you know, one night. Like I'm a pretty high energy person. So I like needed. Weed sometimes. Oh, no, I didn't. Let me reframe that. I thought I needed weed to chill out. And I've been diagnosed with ADHD later in life. So I didn't know that these were probably symptoms of my ADHD. And I was just like, I want to quiet my mind and I can't. And the only thing I thought that really worked for me were substances. and the marijuana just felt like it was a better substance to turn to, but the mental fixation piece, like I said, I spoke for years, but like I took breaks in between, but like in the cycles that I would ebb and flow between smoking, it would be like in the beginning, Oh, I'm just going to smoke after work. Yeah. I'll just take a couple tokes and, you know, read a book then, you know, Month two. And I should actually say week two, not month two. Let me stop playing. The second week it's like, Oh, I'm just going to like, you know, wake and bake just, just a couple of hits. And then, you know, I won't smoke again until I get home. And the next thing, you know, it's like, I'm going by my smoke shop. I have a punch card. I can't help myself. Like I just literally want more and more and my tolerance grows. You don't recognize how much, Of a control the substance has on you and how much it dictates how you live your life. And that's the part that I don't like. Like, I want to be free, Ashley. I just want to be free, you know, I don't want to be a slave. and I think that is not the case for everyone. I just know myself and I know how good I am at tricking. Myself and deluding myself into thinking that I can manage things or moderate and the reality is I'm, just not that girl. Like it's just not how my brain works I just have to know who I am and stop pretending that I can be someone else that I'm not.

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 34:51

And that's exactly it. I think I was just so. I always knew, but in a way I was just like living in denial because I just didn't want it to be that bad. I didn't want to admit it to myself. And yeah. Because no one really like questioned it or really thought anything negative of it. I was like, well, I guess it's fine But when you can actually be honest with yourself and like when I was honest with myself I realized how much it was holding me back again, not necessarily in my day to day life, but in My overall perception of myself and who I wanted to be. And like you said, I want it to be free. I don't want to be tethered to anything. I want to be able to go out for the entire day and not think about when am I going to get home? So I can smoke a joint or do I have to bring one with me? How many should I bring? Like it just takes so much mental energy in the same way that drinking did and trying to moderate. Can I have one drink? Can I have two? Can I have four? It's just exhausting and it's just so much easier. To not live that way and to just have actual room to do other things and to read and actually remember the book, you know, and to run the 10K, but not be nearly as out of breath by the end or not have my lungs hurt in the same way. Like, just because I can do something with weed doesn't mean I have to do something with weed. And I think that is what I realized for myself. And, you know, like I said, I am all for harm reduction, Kali sober, whatever someone needs to do to remove The thing that's the worst for them. And I think if I tried to give everything up all at once, I would have failed. but when you start seeing one thing for what it is, it really gives you the time and space and objectivity to look at all the other things that's going on for you as well. And that could be, you know, phone use could be sugar. It could be so many different things. Right. Um, so yeah, yeah, it's kind of where I'm at with it.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 36:46

Yeah. Beautifully said, and it's funny you should mention the sugar because did you know that sugar is the number one addiction that people have?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 36:54

I just learned that like two weeks ago, and I was like, Is that way I'm drinking so many San Pellegrinos a day? Like the sugary ones, not just the water, the juice.

the-sober-butterfly_3_01-24-2025_171001: 37:03

Isn't that crazy? When I quit drinking alcohol, I started binging sugar and it was actually triggering for me. That is probably the biggest trigger that could have caused me to relapse because I gained like 15, 20 pounds. And I did not like that. Alcohol and it's processed when it metabolizes into your system, it converts into sugar. And so my body was craving this alcohol and I couldn't get it. So like the sugar was the next best thing. obviously we know sugar. In excess quantities is not good for you, but whole picture, it was better for me to do that. And then you adjust because now three and a half years, my sobriety, all of that weight is gone and I'm so glad that I stuck to, you know, my commitment to myself and to my sobriety versus just default to what I knew and what I was comfortable with. And I would love to hear from you because. You have been completely sober for a couple months now. How has your life changed? Have you noticed any changes since, giving up, marijuana use in conjunction with everything else?

ashley_3_01-24-2025_171004: 38:11

Yeah. I definitely feel like, obviously more just awake, like not as foggy every day when you're spending all of your days getting high and it was to the point where I didn't even feel high. It was just. Part of the routine like it feels nice to just actually be clear headed My appetite has come back to being normal My sleep like I didn't dream for like 10 years. It feels like I actually dream again. They are vivid. They are interesting and then I do feel like in a way we Held me back in the sense of I was very tired and, you know, kind of lazy. I would often talk myself out of not needing to do something.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 38:53

And so I've just been able to actually motivate myself a little bit more. I, have a more consistent workout routine. I've been reading and remembering the books. I can maintain a conversation better. And honestly, just even more internally, like I feel. Proud of myself and like, Oh, I can actually do. Hard things that I never really thought I could do before. And that makes me feel like I can accomplish anything. Like it really makes me feel like, okay, what are the things I've always wanted to do that I've never been able to do? And so I signed up for my first half marathon this year and that's going to be in October. So I'm going to start training for that in the spring once it gets warm. Cause right now it's freezing outside and I hate the treadmill. But yeah, I just actually feel like I can take on. Yeah. Life and like whatever it throws at me and feel like no, I can do this Even if it's gonna be a little bit challenging and I never really had that mentality before I never really had that mindset or even that self trust that I could follow through on certain things And now I know that I can and that's a good feeling

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 39:57

That's a beautiful feeling and priceless I Want to touch on something you mentioned earlier, which is just because you can doesn't mean you have to and I think that's the excuses we make for ourselves like you mentioned before like you do a 10k you could do it high but like does that mean That you should. Does that mean that was your optimal performance? Like probably not. And so now look at you, you're like getting ready to train for a half marathon. I ran my first marathon in 2023 In COVID I got into running. I was not a runner before,

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 40:33

Yes Me too. When there's only the one thing to do is to go outside.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 40:37

it makes sense. Right?

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 40:38

100%.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 40:39

Drink and run like those were the two things I did I was trying to prove to myself that I could do it, but like, it was not my performance. I was hung over and I was punishing myself because I was like, no, I have to run. I have to run. And when I got sober and removed all the substances, I was actually able to do it. And I just, like, fulfilled a dream I've had that I never thought I'd be able to do, which is like, run a marathon. And that was like insane.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 41:03

That's incredible.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 41:05

thank you. Well, to your point, like you remove the substances and you're like, Oh, what else can I do if I'm capable of doing this hard thing, like, what else am I capable of? And I don't know if everyone thinks like that, Ashley. I want the next best thing. I'm always like, what's over here. What's over there. Like, how can I be like, get into this next thing.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 41:22

I'm always trying to elevate myself now

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 41:24

Yeah, I'm always going to elevate myself, I'm going to run my first marathon. Like there's always something that I'm chasing, and I'm just so glad that what I'm chasing, and maybe you can resonate with, is something positive. It's not me chasing the next high or chasing the next party. It's me I'm chasing something that will actually give me a real ROI, and that feels so much better. So I want to hear from you, we've talked about marijuana, we've talked about alcohol, you've touched on tobacco use. Through cigarettes and vaping. What was the hardest substance? Now that you have some perspective, what was the hardest substance for you to quit?

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 42:05

I think physically, cigarettes or vaping, just because I had such a like physical dependency on it. Socially, alcohol, because I felt kind of awkward and uncomfortable in those social situations. And I kind of felt like a bit of an outsider at first. And then identity wise, weed. Because like I said, I was so connected. With being a functional stoner or like a chill girl, whatever laid back that part was really difficult for me. So in their own ways, they were all kind of difficult, but for different reasons, I would say. Yeah.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 42:39

love how you broke that down, like identity wise versus socially versus physically. Yeah. I'm trying to like reflect for myself. I think identity for me is actually alcohol. I'm going to say alcohol because I was such a party girl. And I leaned into that. I embraced that identity for so long. I don't want to enter another substance into the chat, but if I had to categorize, I would say alcohol was the hardest for my identity. And then I think socially. The reason why alcohol is such a problem for me is because I would experiment with other drugs. So like Coke and party drugs, pills and stuff like that. So like that would, that's more social as well.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 43:22

It's a slippery slope, very quickly. Yeah.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 43:24

It's a slippery slope. Yeah, it was the girl in the bathroom, I think they were all hard in their own respect, but going back to harm reduction, alcohol baseline had to go first, had to go first. I would not gotten anywhere without removing the alcohol. So thank you for sharing because it's helped me reflect and I would love to just kind of wind down with what practical tools and I'm always like a little Weary about offering advice. So if you're listening at home, this is not us telling you what to do It's more so taking inventory of what we've done and sharing. So what? Has worked for you in terms of really sustaining sobriety and feel free to break it down into those different buckets like you mentioned or just culminating what has worked for you in terms of really helping you, two part question, helping you really get sober tools and then sustaining your sobriety.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 44:23

Yeah, I think like the theme of this whole conversation is like harm reduction. Take what is hurting you the most and leave that one first and you don't even have to make the decision to give up all of the other things, you know, it might happen, it might not and not putting too much pressure on yourself to do any more than just removing that. One really bad thing is I think the perfect place to start. I personally really like counting days and having an app that like shows me my streak, I'm a very like to do list checklist, scratching things off, kind of a person. So I love to see those streaks happening in front of my eyes. And the idea of breaking that streak, like really bothers me. And so that helps to keep me going. Honestly,

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 45:11

My wordle streak is on fire right now.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 45:13

I love that game. I also think, like, Sober Instagram, honestly, really helped keep me, inspired. I have connected with a lot of people just behind the scenes, like, Just chatting with them about weed, about drinking, about reading, running. There's so many different ways to connect with people online. And it is really interesting to look at accounts that, uh, You know, have several years under their belt when you're brand new, or even if you want to follow counts that are maybe a little bit newer. So you're on the same kind of path and you can be like, Oh I really resonate with what they're going through right now. Cause I'm still going through that right now. I found that to be really helpful. I personally am not a part of like a sober community per se, but I would really like to be a part of one. Cause I know that can be really helpful. I have been really lucky to connect with some girls. online that like through Reddit and through Instagram, we were able to connect and meet in person. And so starting to build a little bit of a community there. And obviously like my boyfriend is super helpful in that regard as well. And even my friends who still drink or still smoke weed or whatever, I still find them to be a great support because they are supportive of me. Obviously, if your friends aren't like that, then, you know, that's a different kind of evaluation. But having just people on your side that want to be there for you, encourage you, and are proud of you, are really, you know, helpful things to have on your side. And then I was a bit, Big, I still am. I love to read and I love podcasts. So like podcasts and quitlet have been some of my like favorite things. Like I binged podcasts the first like six months I listened to like three different ones, every single episode I was like listening hours a day and at the same time reading tons because it just, it, I wanted it to be all consuming for me it almost needed to be. And it still kind of is. Cause again, like I'm. about to hit a year in March, but it's still all consuming for me. And in a good way, like, I like that my life is kind of revolving around it right now because it helps make the choice easier every day. And hearing about people's stories and seeing people's stories online and seeing that everyone's still having fun, living their best life, makes me want to do the same. And it makes me want to my story. And yeah, I would say having The community or starting to build one quitlet podcasts, friends and family and harm reduction overall are my practical tips for anyone listening.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 47:55

all of the above. Plus you also talked about treating it like a social experiment, right? Like not being too harsh on yourself, taking it day by day, doing the day counts That worked for me as well. I'm going to add in there. Even if you're not into journaling, like even if you just write on your notes app, just get those emotions out. It's so cathartic and it also just provides high entertainment value when you gain some perspective, right? To look back.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 48:21

When I look back, I was like, I've made a pros and cons list and all these pros, I was like, I don't think these are really pros, but I didn't even realize they were just perceived pros, you know, and it's funny because my cons list was like a page long and my pros was like, maybe four things and even those weren't really pros and just yeah, looking back to see how far you've come so true. It goes such a long way. Parts of me laugh. Parts of me, I'm like, I feel for that girl. It is. It's such a great, I love to journal now. I was never a big journaler, but now I'm a big journaler.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 48:58

something else that you mentioned that I think is really special identity. It seems like you mentioned you're obsessed with the quitlet, you're obsessed with listening to sober podcast, I'm the same way. It's been three and a half years for me and I'm still obsessed. And I would rather have this identity as a sober girl versus the party girl. And I'm assuming you feel the same way. You'd rather be this version of self than like the stoner girl. I am obsessed with sobriety and I feel like it's a good, it's a healthy obsession. It's something that I'm proud to be a part of. Also like staying informed because I do think that yes, as a culture, as a society, we know substance is bad, right? But the more, you know, the more, you know, like the more you understand truly how these things are impacting you, the better, hopefully you will do because ignorance

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 49:54

I didn't even know alcohol was ethanol until I started reading. Like, truthfully, I was so ignorant to it

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 50:01

Yeah, it's poison. It's quite literally poison and I try not to scare people up front. Like I think scare tactics worked up to a certain point and then you're kind of just like, uh, enough. I can't take it. I'm going to literally drink because you're stressing me out with this information. So I try not to scare people too much. And I try, I really do because I'm like, when you're ready, you'll seek knowledge on your own. Like, I don't need to like give you a rundown of all the facts of all the ways in which alcohol is going to cause cancer and all of these other million different disorders.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 50:32

Yeah, because when you start finding it for yourself, you can kind of scare yourself into being like, Oh, I don't need to do like, Why am I doing this to myself?

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 50:39

just showing people What life can look like is what I'm all about. yes, the facts are out there when you're ready to seek them, go find them. But I don't need to be the person that's always drilling into you, like how bad things are. I'd rather just show you how good life is.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 50:53

I'm with you. I'd rather, I'm totally with you on that. Like, I'd rather show you how much more fun my vacation is when I'm not, you know, being sick in this alleyway or missing all the activities that I had planned because now I can actually enjoy everything that's right in front of me. I can actually learn about the culture of the place that I'm in and try all these different foods and I can go out with my friends and remember the whole night and remember our conversations and then not die on the couch the next day. Like, those are actual fun ways to live. Versus what we think fun looks like when we're drinking.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 51:26

You got to redefine fun for you. I don't even think they're having fun, I think it's just what they're used to, and what they're accustomed to, and we are blindly following what society tells us to do, which is drink. Yeah. And when you wake up, I always think of Matrix, Blue Pill, Red Pill, when I decide to take that Red Pill. Baby, I, yeah, I'm never turning back. Plug me out.

the-sober-butterfly_2_01-08-2025_164227: 51:50

And now a quick word from our partners. Have you ever wished you could dive into a great story while on the go? Maybe that's during your daily commute or even while working out. Well, now you can, thanks to Audible. Audible is the leading provider of spoken word entertainment in audiobooks, and with Audible, you can turn any moment into a storytime adventure. Imagine having access to an unmatched selection of audiobooks, right now. Exclusive podcast and more all in one place Audible is not just a library. It's a whole Experience with a vast collection of genres from mystery to romance to self help and business Audible has something for everyone and here's the best part Your first month is on me A free trial to explore the world of Audible. Check the show notes below and visit audible. com slash tsb24 to start your free trial today. Don't miss out on an opportunity to discover the joy of listening. Whether you're a seasoned book lover or just getting started, Audible is the perfect companion for your reading journey. So why wait? Head over to audible. com slash tsb24. Audible. Because the best stories are meant to be heard.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 53:15

Butterflies at home, if you want to connect with Ashley, how can they find you, how can they stay locked in? Can you share? All of your socials.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 53:25

Absolutely. Yeah, so I mean, maybe my millennial self like doesn't do anything other than instagram. I have a threads, but like I haven't used it in any way, shape or form. So my instagram is like the main place you can find me. I'm alcohol free ash. I do talk about weed. I talk about drinking. And I share just like parts of my life, things that I thought of myself. Ways that I'm going through life now with sobriety. And yeah, you can find me there.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 53:57

Are you going to start anything of your own Ashley, like a podcast

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 54:00

Honestly, I don't know. I would love to. I think one day I genuinely would love to. But I think this year I'm actually going to apply for my master's in psychotherapy. So in about two and a half years, y'all can hit me up for some therapy, some counseling, some addiction, some recovery, and then I'll be professionally licensed and I can Help people that way. But for now I'm just giving unsolicited firsthand personal experience, advice and moments on my Instagram account, but maybe podcast one day.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 54:36

you've been such a light Ashley. Thank you for sharing your story with us and all of your amazing insights. I'll leave your Instagram handle in the show notes for people to connect with you. Thank you so much for coming on the show today.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 54:50

Oh, well, I appreciate all of your time and having me on here. It's honestly been so much fun. Hope we can do it again one day. We'll do like a, you know, a yearly catch up.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-24-2025_173613: 55:00

You don't need an invite. Just let me know when you want to come back and you can come whenever.

ashley_4_01-24-2025_173614: 55:06

Perfect. Love it. Love it. Thank you.

the-sober-butterfly_4_01-30-2025_081735: 55:11

Wow, what an episode. Ashley's Journey is such a great reminder that sobriety is not a one size fits all, and it's okay to take things at your own pace, whether you're in your first month or a few years in. We're all constantly learning, growing, and redefining what fun and fulfillment looks like. If you loved this conversation, please subscribe. Do me a favor, rate and review this episode, wherever you're listening. It helps so much in spreading the message and bringing more people into our amazing sober butterfly community. And if Ashley's story resonated with you, share this episode with a friend who might need a little inspiration. You never know who might be thinking about making a change. Until next time, keep flying high, sober butterflies. Bye